Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

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fungus3
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Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby fungus3 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:46 pm

It's as if the mutations INTENTIONALLY kill smart organisms, and prevent them from appearing! Shouldn't mutations LEAD to intelligence?!

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Alast
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Alast » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:10 pm

Mutation leads to efficiency. Intelligence is not efficient if it costs too much energy
Perfection hasnt reached me yet, but it tries hard!

fungus3
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby fungus3 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:47 pm

Then how can intelligent organisms evolve from dumb ones?

HOW DOES THE MUTATION WORK; I DEMAND AN EXPLANATION

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Petter
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Petter » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:56 pm

"I DEMAND AN EXPLANATION", this is not very nice.

Evolution typically leads to an organism better suited to the environment (exactly what that means I'm not really sure, I guess more copies of offspring?). If a smart organism is not better suited, then it will become dumb. A substrate with high radiation makes organisms with complex designs prone to death by a small mutation, and they are thus not well suited. Make sure to evolve with tiny radiation and long time in that case.

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H4yw1r3
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby H4yw1r3 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 3:14 am

Also, since smart organisms have a certain mapping in it's genome, it's highly prone to extinction due to mistakes made by the radiation (like M3 changing its splits to M23 and M5).
I have my organisms encased in capsules, most of them are harmful in a way..

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Alast
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Alast » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:19 pm

@Petter, I think what you called better suited is what I called more efficient. You could define an organisms efficiency as: capability of producing reproductive bio mass.
Perfection hasnt reached me yet, but it tries hard!

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Petter
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Petter » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:43 pm

Yea I get what you mean. What I was trying to convey is that perhaps a smart organism is the most efficient on a certain substrate. But once you turn up radiation, it is not the same substrate anymore and that will not be the most efficient anymore since it is very sensitive towards radiation damage.

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Alast
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Alast » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:55 pm

Totally agree! The more complex a system is the easier it is to break it :-)
Perfection hasnt reached me yet, but it tries hard!

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Nayus
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby Nayus » Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:49 pm

Simpler organisms are way waay more favored by evolution than smart ones. Jumping from a smart organism to a dumb one is much easier than jumping from a dumb to a smart one.

Almost in every order, simpler organisms are stronger and more effective than smart ones. They re more resistant to radiation, they need less energy to reproduce and therefore produce more numbers before they die, in almost every enviroment.

The only enviroment that favors smart ones is coincidentally the one that completelly kills dumb organisms so you cannot just create a scarce enviroment and drop a dumb organism and wait a million hours and be guaranteed that there will be a smart one then because the dumb organism will simply die.
Or worse, will struggle forever, then die. Because even if it manages tu survive the amount of energy it would have to spend to go from dumb to smart is too much, it will die before going through the neccesary steps.

In conclusion natural evolution from dumb to smart might be the hardest thing to do in the game.

fungus3
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Re: Mutations favoring extinction over intelligence

Postby fungus3 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:10 pm

Petter wrote:Yea I get what you mean. What I was trying to convey is that perhaps a smart organism is the most efficient on a certain substrate. But once you turn up radiation, it is not the same substrate anymore and that will not be the most efficient anymore since it is very sensitive towards radiation damage.


Correction: "once you turn ON radiation"

Then can you please change how radiation works so that it helps smart species develop, regardless of efficiency? Because evolution is more about surviving to reproduce rather than efficiency. Radiation is supposed to help organisms adapt to exotic environments, not kill them outright if they are more complex than a basic swimmer.

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