Move it!

Post your own challenge to your fellow researchers!
User avatar
bwisialo
Posts: 2953
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:22 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by bwisialo » Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:40 pm

Well, the effects of lower or higher priority are going to depend on the organism and environment to an extent. And in this case, the distribution problem that the front cells get into with a higher priority Phagocyte doesn't happen only when eggs are produced: whenever it eats, you have a relatively oversized cell with a higher priority, with the front cells losing significant mass from continuous splitting. Also, in general, the higher the priority of the egg-producing cell, the longer it will take for the egg to split.

I wonder if 90-10 splits at max Salinity are buggy in some way -- like the loss is too low and yield too high. I know that adding Devorocytes changes the equation, but it also seems a bit much that a single inserted Phagocyte can split 65+ times with 0 nutrients (180 degrees at max Friction and Viscosity).
amor fati
User avatar
bwisialo
Posts: 2953
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:22 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by bwisialo » Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:35 pm

I have a non-smart genome that sustains 60+. I'm thinking that 100+ is doable.
amor fati
User avatar
Alast
Posts: 2347
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:15 am

Re: Move it!

Post by Alast » Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:45 pm

Hm... New substrate then?
Perfection hasnt reached me yet, but its trying hard!
User avatar
wapcaplet
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:52 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by wapcaplet » Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:00 pm

Some more time with guided evolution has me up to 700+ on the harder substrate (same 2-cell version). I think I can hit 1000 with a little more work :-)

An insight occurred to me while watching the evolution. Every cell fart produces some tiny piece of nutrient, no? The fart is just a cell with not enough mass to stay alive, so it dies in a poof of smoke. All cells that die leave behind a nutrient, so all smart-farters are constantly leaving a trail of nutrients, for however brief a time. All our smart organisms in this challenge seek food. Hence, all our smart-farters are automatically self-seeking, and thus swarming.
smarmers1.png
smarmers1.png (14.01 KiB) Viewed 2407 times
For a while I thought the big clumps were just because everyone's going for the same chunk of nutrient at once. That's a big part of where the clumps form, but they stay clustered together for a while after the nutrient that attracted them is eaten. If the entire cluster suddenly detected "no food", they should all (or mostly) revert to their default behavior (which is "turn right" in my genome), but that's not the case; they all keep turning left and right to try and stay among their group.

Does this help their efficiency? Is it smarter to be swarming than non-swarming? I would think so--in this organism, their accuracy up-close is poor. One farter has a difficult time hitting a nutrient on the first try, and must circle around it and readjust quite a bit. If each farter is likely to be bringing some friends, their odds (as a group) of picking up the nutrient are increased.
User avatar
Alast
Posts: 2347
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:15 am

Re: Move it!

Post by Alast » Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:20 pm

I have noticed this kind of behavior, too, and found it very interesting to watch :-) You're probably right that the immediately dying cells are the reason for the clumps are staying together so long.
Perfection hasnt reached me yet, but its trying hard!
User avatar
bwisialo
Posts: 2953
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2015 10:22 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by bwisialo » Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:38 pm

Well, it wasn't difficult to design, but it's also not the most obvious thing in the world. Initial Phagocyte, to Lipocyte front (set to 5 degree split by the initial cell), splitting 90-10, with Phagocyte back producing initial cells. It gets around to food just fine, so I don't know if increased Viscosity would help necessitate a smart solution.

Higher cell count Objective might be better route. I doubt 200 would be sustainable, but it might be with a worm and or Lipo-dumping. It's already very difficult: probably not even necessary to require a smart solution. I mean, I have a non-smart solution to Desert, but there's no need to change the challenge.
amor fati
User avatar
wapcaplet
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:52 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by wapcaplet » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:24 am

I've maxed out the second substrate. Even more than that, I've maxed this one too: https://www.dropbox.com/s/668j083tg9i2x ... trate?dl=0

Same conditions, but chunk size is only about 0.25 :twisted:
User avatar
wapcaplet
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:52 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by wapcaplet » Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:08 am

I hate to say it, but the more I look at this, the more I think this is a bug. I just maxed the same substrate with chunk size of only 0.04. They will even grow and reproduce with 0 nutrients, especially if I place several initial cells so they can immediately begin swarming.

My high priority stereocyte grows larger with every fart on a 0-nutrient substrate. My theory is that if a 90/10 split actually gives 92 or 93% back, and the so-called 10% child actually gets 28%, then there is a net gain in nutrients after the phagocyte reabsorbs the dead cell's food bit.
User avatar
wapcaplet
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:52 pm

Re: Move it!

Post by wapcaplet » Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:17 am

300 cells and counting on a completely barren substrate.
User avatar
Reaper Elite
Posts: 737
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 10:55 pm
Location: In the Underworld eating bacon and watching anime with Marilyn Monroe

Re: Move it!

Post by Reaper Elite » Sun Feb 12, 2017 4:04 am

could you post that genome :?:
"A mercenary can always find a war to fight if they look hard enough"
"You become a changed person when you face me and deny me your soul."
Post Reply